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Post by lumpy on Jan 22, 2008 22:36:14 GMT -5
I think those on the Left like to paint Conservatives as Religious HOWEVER; very few of the Conservatives I know are overly Religious.. if Religious at all. Would you consider Reagan, Bush Sr, Gingrich, Bush Jr. Religious? AND by Religious I mean Religion guides their political decision making? Remember it was Bill Clinton who made a point to campaign in Baptist Churches, he stumped in many more than any Republican. The Pubs you mentioned aren't particularly religious, but many of the decisions they made were made because of their constituency, which includes the Religious Right. Clinton campaigned in Baptist churches in order to win the disenfranchised black vote, which the Republican Party had written off during the Reagan era. More to do with demographics than religion, methinks. |
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Post by RO on Jan 22, 2008 22:41:43 GMT -5
To me marriage is about having a family, having children. Two men, two woman, can not have children.... yes yes I know they can adopt. Why is it so terrible to keep marriage defined as a man and a woman, husband and wife, mother and father? Why do we need to change the definition? MY only comment to this goods...is that it truely and deeply hurt me each and EVERY time my now exh told me that he and I were not a family because we did NOT have children. I was NOT the one that could NOT conceive. I thought HE and I were a FAMILY... Just my two cents. I see all kinds of families...at the library each and every day from all walks of life and representing many countries since John Deere Headquarters is here and they bring in people from all ends of the earth... |
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Post by goods on Jan 22, 2008 22:43:46 GMT -5
I may agree that the Bush boys may pander to their constituency. But Reagan and Gingrich did not follow the polls as much. They said this is what I am going to do, if you want that vote for me....
To me it the difference between Leaders and Politicians.
Politicians say, tell me what you want and I will do it..
Leaders say this is what I will do and do it.
I think you would be hard pressed to find examples of any of them bowing to the "Religious Right" just because it was what the RR wanted it. There may be things that they believed in that the RR also believed in BUT that does not mean they were were bowing to the RR's wishes.
AND Reagan did not "write off" anyone... that's why we was known as the great uniter.
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Post by lumpy on Jan 22, 2008 22:45:45 GMT -5
AND Reagan did not "write off" anyone... that's why we was known as the great uniter. What percentage of the black vote did he get in the two elections he won?  |
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Post by goods on Jan 22, 2008 22:50:15 GMT -5
To me marriage is about having a family, having children. Two men, two woman, can not have children.... yes yes I know they can adopt. Why is it so terrible to keep marriage defined as a man and a woman, husband and wife, mother and father? Why do we need to change the definition? MY only comment to this goods...is that it truely and deeply hurt me each and EVERY time my now exh told me that he and I were not a family because we did NOT have children. I was NOT the one that could NOT conceive. I thought HE and I were a FAMILY... Just my two cents. I see all kinds of families...at the library each and every day from all walks of life and representing many countries since John Deere Headquarters is here and they bring in people from all ends of the earth... Look you can take examples of couples in the 70's getting married, obviously they won't be having children or someone that can't have children. The point of marriage WHICH WE ALL HERE KNOW DOESN'T ALWAYS WORK OUT is to have a family, it betters society having a married mother and father raising children. IN GENERAL don't give me shit about alcoholic fathers etc. How does a man/man or woman/woman being married have any benefit to society. Tell me what would be different if they just lived together. Marriage = Man/Woman Civil Union = Same Sex...... I am sure you don't realize that there is a large percentage of folks in the gay community that agree with me. |
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Post by goods on Jan 22, 2008 22:56:47 GMT -5
AND Reagan did not "write off" anyone... that's why we was known as the great uniter. What percentage of the black vote did he get in the two elections he won? Read this: www.heartland.org/Article.cfm?artId=15345 |
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Post by lumpy on Jan 22, 2008 23:01:15 GMT -5
“Reagan began a sustained attack on the government’s civil rights apparatus, opened an assault on affirmative action and social welfare programs, [and] embraced the white racist leaders of then-apartheid South Africa. ...” I believe that that sentence pretty much encapsulates hoe most blacks saw Reagan. I believe in 1980 he received less than 5% of the black vote. That's just off the top of my head though. |
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Post by goods on Jan 22, 2008 23:02:56 GMT -5
dude you didn't read past the first line?  epic fail! |
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Post by RO on Jan 22, 2008 23:05:55 GMT -5
I'm sure that there are people in the gay community that agree with you.
I have friends on both sides of the spectrum and I am not trying to start an argument with you on this topic.
I just as passionate about the definition of family as you are...
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Post by goods on Jan 22, 2008 23:07:33 GMT -5
I'm sure that there are people in the gay community that agree with you. I have friends on both sides of the spectrum and I am not trying to start an argument with you on this topic. I just as passionate about the definition of family as you are... I can take it RO. Generally I tried to avoid political "discussions" on the internet. It's not like anyone has ever actual changed their position after a bunch of cyber dueling. |
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Post by RO on Jan 22, 2008 23:10:30 GMT -5
I'm sure that there are people in the gay community that agree with you. I have friends on both sides of the spectrum and I am not trying to start an argument with you on this topic. I just as passionate about the definition of family as you are... I can take it RO. Generally I tried to avoid political "discussions" on the internet. It's not like anyone has ever actual changed their position after a bunch of cyber dueling. LOL...I know you can totally take anything I throw at you. That is not the issue! LOL. I understand your point of view. I listen to this topic debated on a daily basis in almost every aspect of my life... So don't worry, I bet I have HEARD it all! I know you can take it...you are from NKY...you better be able to take it... |
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Post by RO on Jan 22, 2008 23:19:13 GMT -5
Oh, and for the record...
I do NOT believe that.
Read some political blogs...I think a discussion can bring about a change in someone who is questioning things and is open minded...might be hard to find on this particular forum...LOL!
BUT...I will tell you that I know of 2 die hard people that totally shocked me when they participated in the Caucus...
I was shocked! If THEY can change their minds to this magnitude...wow!
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Post by goods on Jan 23, 2008 8:30:16 GMT -5
Oh, and for the record... I do NOT believe that. Read some political blogs...I think a discussion can bring about a change in someone who is questioning things and is open minded...might be hard to find on this particular forum...LOL! BUT...I will tell you that I know of 2 die hard people that totally shocked me when they participated in the Caucus... I was shocked! If THEY can change their minds to this magnitude...wow! You will never convince me of that RO... nope never! |
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Post by Dave on Jan 23, 2008 9:38:14 GMT -5
i thought families were about love.
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Post by goods on Jan 23, 2008 9:41:35 GMT -5
I thought we were talking about defining marriage. Oh and how Conservatives hate and Liberals care.
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