ladyj
New Member
Posts: 7
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Post by ladyj on Mar 25, 2008 13:46:40 GMT -5
Are you cheatin' on me again there frecks ole boy??!!!
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Post by freckles on Mar 25, 2008 13:47:53 GMT -5
Are you cheatin' on me again there frecks ole boy??!!! If You Hop a Bus to Texas I will Marry You
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Post by Phoenixx on Mar 25, 2008 14:01:51 GMT -5
Ion - I dont think you're high maintanance at all.
You want what you want. So what? You've spent so long telling yourself that your needs are unreasonable that you're now actually believing it. Why? Why at all? I don't understand, because, althoughI dont know you very well, I see an intelligent, attractive woman who has all the right boxes ticked. When you bring so much to the table, where you are caring, loving, easy going, etc - why should you settle for something else? You've tried settling, but the fact that you keep going back to the low and horrible feelings show that settling is not for you. So why are you even attempting it?
You want someone to be romantic - not such a bad thing. How many of us here wouldn't love some romance? It's high on my list. You want to be loved - not such a bad thing. How many of us want to be loved? Pretty much everyone. You want to mean everything to someone - not such a bad thing. I know I want to mean everything to someone, especially as a significant other.
I could go on and on, but as far as I can see, your wanting these things do not mean bad things. It just means you know what you want.
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Post by freckles on Mar 25, 2008 14:06:49 GMT -5
You are so sweet Freckles. I don't think you'd enjoy going out with me very much. I think I'm what they call "high maintenance"! Do you like Twinkies ? I would bring You Twinkies
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Post by kittenhart on Mar 25, 2008 14:13:08 GMT -5
But then how do I know if you are right or if this is something I should be changing? The more I read about and the more i delve into therapy the more I find things wrong with me. Are they wrong or not? I'm so confused. Ah, the politics of psychotherapy.....I don't know whether to laugh or cry at this one...but you hit right on the essence of it. (Plus I bet your psychologist is a male, right?....no offence to any males, especially you JimB because so far I am in agreement with everything you've said....but sometimes that can be undermining.) I think the underlying assumption in therapy is that the problem fundamentally lies with you and needs changing...which isn't always the case. I am way less clingy since I left my ex because my friends and family actually enjoy my company and act like they want to spend time with me and are happy to be around me....so like Shey said, the abandonment issue just kindof goes away on its own. (I like being single, for the most part, and feel better and more stable than I have in years.) That being said, it will probably raise its ugly head when I do enter another relationship because that's the thing about these interpersonal issues.....they aren't usually issues until there is another person involved. So I think that going to therapy to try and deal with it is probably a good and useful thing for you....the trick is to be able to recognize when it is no longer useful to you and terminate it then....no point being in therapy forever, no point in assuming that you are so essentially flawed that you can never make it without therapy, and everything about you has to change, ya know what I mean? Seriously, you are not so essentially flawed, Ion....maybe a little f*cked up but aren't we all? modified to add that I agree with Phoenix that you only want what most people want and that doesn't make you high maintenance. (((hugs)))) khart
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Post by sheyd on Mar 25, 2008 14:37:49 GMT -5
"Finding things wrong with you"... I am a HUGE fan of psychotherapy, but there is one version I like best. It is "strength-based". If you constantly wear at yourself and think of yourself in terms of your "flaws" - which we all have - you will not have the strength to do what needs to be done. If you look at your strengths - and you have many of them - you can see them as your tools to accomplish what you need to accomplish, within yourself and your world. If you only see flaws, how can a flaw fix a flaw? There are things you can work on - and you can do that work BECAUSE you are strong and good and worth it. So... you are a person who needs a certain type of love shown to feel good. Take that knowledge, and look to find that in the real world. Look at that as a strength (you know yourself) and go from there. If you want to alter that (SOME) by all means do so - FOR YOURSELF. Don't do it to help him, or make your counselor happy... do it to achieve YOUR OWN goals. Which you CAN achieve, because you ARE self-aware. And don't change yourself because you "need fixing" - but alter yourself to achieve a "better perfection". You are human, and a wonderful one at that! Shey
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Post by JimB on Mar 25, 2008 14:41:03 GMT -5
I think the underlying assumption in therapy is that the problem fundamentally lies with you and needs changing...which isn't always the case. Agreed, and well said. Sometimes you have to look at a therapist as being similar to a plumber, or an electrician - if you call on one, they will assume there is a problem and try to address it. It's up to you to decide whether there really is a problem. Of course, determining whether or not there's a problem is the hardest part. To this end, Io, I guess at this point I would ask what you can do to simplify your life. It sounds like you're getting a great deal of input from a lot of different sources, and the cumulative effect is a lot of confusion. Your friends, your family, your therapist, us - all can offer guidance and tips, but the real motivation for growth and change must come from within. How is your inner voice lately? What has it been saying? You will grow on your own if you allow it to happen - you just need an idea in your head of what direction you want to go. Therapy, like anything else, is a tool to speed you along that path. You have the ability to use or discard any of the tools at your disposal. If something isn't helping you, leave it behind.
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Post by Saucy on Mar 25, 2008 15:48:26 GMT -5
you are phenomenal jimB...
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Post by lumpy on Mar 25, 2008 16:01:39 GMT -5
you are phenomenal jimB... He's the magnificent with the sensational style He can go on and on for like a mile, a minute He gets in it like a car and drives it And if the record is smashed, He can still survive it
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Post by gdgross on Mar 25, 2008 18:06:49 GMT -5
You are in love with an illusion of what you want him to be. +1 I read your posts and I don't understand why you keep subjecting yourself to this torture, ion. You keep saying that you've never connected with anyone else like him, that no one gets you like him, etc, etc. But I don't get it. I think his behaviour and all of this emotional turmoil you are going through is the very evidence that shows you don't connect and he doesn't get you. You are chasing after a vapor, a dream that will never materialize. Think about the road you were on a few months ago without him. They don't say no contact just for the hell of it.
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Post by lumpy on Mar 25, 2008 18:19:04 GMT -5
I read your posts and I don't understand why you keep subjecting yourself to this torture, ion. You keep saying that you've never connected with anyone else like him, that no one gets you like him, etc, etc. But I don't get it. I think his behaviour and all of this emotional turmoil you are going through is the very evidence that shows you don't connect and he doesn't get you. That's exactly why I think the drug addiction metaphor works so well. I loved my drug, even when I knew it was killing me. You can love something or someone even as it is tearing you to shreds.
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Post by ionysis on Mar 26, 2008 2:24:52 GMT -5
I think my problem is that when I'm with R I have a tendency to divert my focus away from all the other things I was concentrating on. But I DON'T think that is just him - I think that is a problem in myself - it happens every time I get very emotionally involved in a relationship. I believe that is something I need to work on. Keeping my relationships as a PART of my life - an important part of course but nonetheless not the only focus.
I think that women more than men do have a tendency to make their SOs and families everything in their lives and I think many women are frustrated and dissatisfied that their needs are not met for this very reason. I don't think, for example, that I would make a happy housewife. I believe I would hyperfocus on husband and children to the exclusion of other things and end up wanting my husband to meet ALL my needs because I wasn't getting them met through interaction with various groups of people and activities outside the home.
I am going to spend some time considering which of my "needs" are actually reasonable expectations in a relationship and which are obsessive or based on neediness, compulsion or unhealthy fears.
I am also going to spend some time concentrating on my goals and life plans - regardless of who I end up being with. I have a big problem with dwelling on and obsessing over things until I build them into a mountain. That has to stop.
The key things for me to be balanced rather than obsessive are: 1. enough sleep 2. regular excercise 3. not drinking excessively 4. a balanced social life and keeping up with my girlfriends 5. making time for family 6. working effectively 7. enjoying some "me" time
I have to focus on getting these right as a priority over and above my relationship with R. The times I get really needy and start to complain that I'm not being shown enough love/attention/being made to feel special etc, etc, etc. is when the above things are out of whack - particularly the sleeping, exercise and alcohol. If those are right then the relationship doesn't overshadow everything else in my mind because I am calmer, more balanced and feel strong rather than afraid.
If I don't obsess over the relationship he is also so much better with me. When he feels pressured he cuts me off and tries to push me away but when I'm relaxed he DOES make an effort to be thoughtful and feels comfortable enough to be affectionate and loving to me.
The important thing for me to do is to focus on my life in the round and walking the path I want to walk for myself. As long as I am not changing my life plans for him and am still making progress down that road he can still be in my life. As soon as I start going down a cul-de-sac with him and diverting my plans to assume we will be together that is when things could get very ugly for me.
I'm going to try to move my attention away from "us" and onto getting everything else in my life settled. I have to just let things go and prioritize more effectively. This relationship should NOT be the most important thing in the world right now - perhaps not ever.
Thanks so much for your input. It may seem like I don't listen and that I just continue to beat my head against a brick wall but I read everything everyone says and I do think about it all and appreciate the advice. I know I fall into the same pit over and over again, you are right. I do keep getting hurt and subjecting myself to pain - but I also think JimB is right when he says that much of it is pain I create for myself.
I also don't necessarily think the answer is walking away. I acknowledge the "drug" metaphor and to an extent I agree. However sometimes addictions have to be managed rather than cut off cold turkey. An alcoholic can stop drinking alcohol altogether, a drug addict can completely cut drugs out of his life but a compulsive eater can't stop eating entirely. It is similar with someone who has an unhealthy attitude to relationships - they cannot simply swear off relationships for the rest of their life. Well I won't anyway. I have to LEARN how to be healthy and independent whilst being in love with someone. And I don't believe in walking away.
So many people on here were left by spouses who decided that things were just too hard to fix, or who wouldn't face their problems. I will not be one of those people. There is of course a time when you HAVE to throw in the towel, a time when it becomes impossible to keep trying. But I haven't got there yet. I want to keep trying. I want to try to make things work. I want us both to be healthy and happy. We have agreed that if we cannot be happy together we will have to be happy apart and I WILL walk away if or when I come to the definite conclusion that we can NEVER make the relationship healthy. But we haven't finished trying. Both of us are still interested in trying to work things out - despite the pain of it.
The pain is real and is awful sometimes and I value the support I have here so much but I believe that removing the source of the pain is not always the only way of making it go away - yes it is ONE way but there are losses involved and it’s a big decision to make. If your arm was broken you wouldn't necessarily cut it off, you would try everything you could to make it heal before resorting to that measure. Only when it became so gangrenous that it threatened the rest of your body would you feel you had to remove it. I don't think we've got there yet.
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Post by JimB on Mar 26, 2008 8:12:38 GMT -5
I like your plan, Io. Just be kind to yourself when you slip up, and reward yourself for even the most seemingly insignificant progress. Keep us posted.
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Post by freckles on Mar 26, 2008 9:41:39 GMT -5
You should call Dr Laura Slessenger
1-800-375-2872
You can Fax Her at 1-(818)461-5140
She will help you
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Post by sheyd on Mar 26, 2008 11:04:35 GMT -5
If I don't obsess over the relationship he is also so much better with me. When he feels pressured he cuts me off and tries to push me away but when I'm relaxed he DOES make an effort to be thoughtful and feels comfortable enough to be affectionate and loving to me. And this is why I think you can't EVER fully heal with this guy. The truth is, EVERYONE has down times, insecure times, etc. You can achieve an appropriate distance/self-composure... but what happens when you really DO need him- in an area it would be appropriate? A sick child or parent, a death of a friend, job loss or discomfort, major illness? If you can't EVER lean on him without him going buggy (and it isn't just about the relationship that he pushes you away) how can you make a true partnership? And how affectionate and loving IS he? No kisses? I DO understand not walking away - I DO believe in working on it - I even believe the best way TO work on it is within a relationship, eventually. However - is THIS relationship the right one to do it in? Is THIS relationship going to be a positive one in the long run? I'm sorry - I read all your posts - this IS a good list of things to do and work you can do for yourself - in or out of a relationship. They will keep you healthy... BUT - I think you are using the idea that you want to work on yourself to justify staying somewhere you know ISN'T healthy. As if you can get healthy, and suddenly IT will be healthy - and that just isn't true. You are only half of this equation, again - and I just don't see long term that he will be able to be a healthy person for you. I'm sorry I am so negative, and it isn't because I don't support you! I just want to look into the future, and where will you be even if you CAN get all your emotions all lined up in a row like little ducks and never let them run away with you (which, btw - is probably impossible - that is super-human and pretty much either not possible or not healthy). As I do, I imagine that he WOULD get better - to some extent - but I just don't see his follow-through being there. I don't see it in what you post. Where is HIS efforts? NOT his response to your efforts - but what HE is doing to get his half healthy? Shey
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