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Post by sheyd on Jun 30, 2008 15:52:48 GMT -5
We are planning to declaw. I know many people think this is extremely inhumane. I have kids, and a lot of pets, my cats are indoor only, and I although I intend to be caring and loving in every other way - I do intend to keep my family/home safer this way. I also know people who have gotten rid of their cat because it was so destructive. So... although I applaud anyone who keeps their cat indoors/fully clawed - it is the preferable way - I am weighing in on the declaw side. Anyone else have any opinions?
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Post by Kim Possible on Jun 30, 2008 22:14:11 GMT -5
I've had quite a few cats in my day, and have never declawed. However when I moved into my apt three years ago, i came very close to doing it. Within months, my cat destroyed my brand new couch. I am guessing the reason was b/c there are no carpets in my apt. In my last apt, he had a 'special spot' where he let out his need to scratch. Our landlord was not very sensitive to his need to let it out, thus we did not get our deposit back . So I did consider doing it. Honestly, I never got around to it, nor did I have the money to do it at the time. And now, I kinda feel like he is too old (he's 9). But if I were to get a kitten again, I think I would do it, but much sooner.
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Post by freckles on Jun 30, 2008 23:12:02 GMT -5
We are planning to declaw. I know many people think this is extremely inhumane. I have kids, and a lot of pets, my cats are indoor only, and I although I intend to be caring and loving in every other way - I do intend to keep my family/home safer this way. I also know people who have gotten rid of their cat because it was so destructive. So... although I applaud anyone who keeps their cat indoors/fully clawed - it is the preferable way - I am weighing in on the declaw side. Anyone else have any opinions? If anouther cat/Dog/Skunk/Anamal attacks them that is how they protect themselves With thier Claws and Teeth
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Post by sheyd on Jul 1, 2008 8:00:00 GMT -5
If anouther cat/Dog/Skunk/Anamal attacks them that is how they protect themselves With thier Claws and Teeth But that is why I keep them indoors only. They also use those teeth and claws to kill other animals for sport. Not only is it dangerous to them to go outside, but they are dangerous to other creatures. Inside, with no predators, they don't need their claws.
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Post by freckles on Jul 1, 2008 8:25:34 GMT -5
They need them to eat mice and birds
What if a Virus kills most of the People
They could not survive because they could not catch thier natural food - birds and mice
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Post by JimB on Jul 1, 2008 8:30:31 GMT -5
I can tell you that my ex, the vet, came to have more and more misgivings about the procedure over time. She equated it to lopping off the last digit of each of your fingers - ouch! However, they're not people, and they do get a pretty sweet deal from us overall (not to mention the extended life). In my case, it's probably much more humane to declaw than the cumulative effect of being thrown across the room every time it sinks those claws into me.
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Post by sheyd on Jul 1, 2008 8:46:54 GMT -5
Freckles - a house cat doesn't need to eat those things, and most outdoor cats (with the exception of working barn cats, or feral cats) don't need to eat them either - and often don't. They kill them for sport, but don't eat them. This isn't a wild animal, it is a housepet. Do you spay/neuter, or do you just let them be natural? Natural isn't really best for most cats, and definitely they should be spayed or neutered - it is heartbreaking how many kittens/cats are in the shelters.
Yeah, Jim, that is my feeling too. I don't LIKE that I have to do it, and for those that are comfy dealing with the effects of a cat having claws - I think that is great! But how long will the kids play with them if they get bloody scratches? I had one cat who we got when she was too old to declaw - I hated having her on my lap, because every time she got happy she kneaded - putting little bloody holes in me right through jeans. I think the fact that they get people angry at them less, get more affection and play time, and that the pain only lasts as long as a regular surgery (as long as it is done young enough) makes it an unhappy but better alternative.
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dunno
New Member
Posts: 6
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Post by dunno on Jul 1, 2008 12:09:02 GMT -5
This is a surgical amputation that is illegal in many other countries for very good reason. It is done for the convenience of the human, and gives no benefit to the cat. It is not a part of the anatomy that cats basically use outside. That is such a false belief. Unlike humans who walk on their feet, cats walk on their toes, so this would be like cutting off the last knuckle of your toes. And it hurts, more than neutering or spaying so don't liken the two. Cats are extremely stoic and hide their pain very very well so it's impossible to gauge just how much pain they go through with this amputation. It's not like they can have a bed pan and a wheelchair for the duration of healing, they still have to walk on those paws. Many issues can arise after surgery.
There are so many other options to declawing. Although I'm not really sure why you opened this thread since you seem so set on doing this.
As far as protecting children, I grew up with four siblings and we had cats our entire lives. None of us ever stopped playing with them because they had claws. Cat scratches happen. I've been scratched by a declawed cat.
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Post by JimB on Jul 1, 2008 13:14:17 GMT -5
dunno, I do agree with one of your points, which is if the kids are so easily discouraged by cat scratches, they may be a little soft.
As for the other stuff, they are CATS, not people. Don't overhumanize them. True, we know very little about their pain thresholds, but we also know very little about their entire experience of pain - it could be so different from our own as to be incomparable. So we operate based on observable data, and the observable data is that they suffer for a week or so, then either recover or adjust and have happy lives. Don't get me wrong - I do think there's an ethical dilemma here, I just don't think that dilemma includes pain. (And BTW, I need a link to your source that says cats walk on their toes, because I believe that is flat out wrong.)
The other factor I forgot to mention is that if you already have a declawed cat in the house (as I believe shey does), all other cats should be declawed as well. Otherwise it's an unfair advantage in the pecking order.
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Post by freckles on Jul 1, 2008 13:30:49 GMT -5
I headrd that they can only declaw the Frount Paws
So the Back ones are still there in case they have to use them on a Dog that wants to eat them
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Post by sheyd on Jul 1, 2008 13:44:39 GMT -5
Like I said, I stopped allowing my undeclawed cat on my lap. Sure, cat scratches happen (and they hurt) - hole pokes happen. And yes, it IS a surgery. It is a surgery they go through for the comfort of not only the rest of the family, but them too. They live a happier life with me without claws than they would with them - guaranteed! I do NOT take kindly to clawed/holed/pulled furniture, clawed kids, or clawed ME.
How do you know it hurts worse than neutering? I know my declawed cats are perfectly happy after the relatively brief recovery period, evidenced by their actions. I know they are happier than my non-declawed cat was for their lifetime based on MY actions!
There ARE other options to declawing - I have looked into them, and experienced them (except those gluey claw tip things, but they are both a pain in the butt and a lifelong expense.)
As to why I opened this - it was for exactly that reason and response. I think the tide of opinion is going to non-declawing, and I think there are TWO sides to this issue. I think non-declawing is a legitimate and appropriate belief, but so is declawing. It is kind of like circumcision - there are reasons for both ways...
People who choose to have a cat and keep them indoors (which I think is the only appropriate way to have a cat unless they are legitimate working mousers) get to deal with the many varied personalities of the cats - and the effects. Rather than ditching problem animals, declawing is one way to get rid of the problem rather than the cat BEFORE the issue starts. Some get lucky and have an easy cat, or don't care if things get clawed up. For the rest, though...
And yes, Freckles, that is true.
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dunno
New Member
Posts: 6
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Post by dunno on Jul 1, 2008 13:47:01 GMT -5
Nope, cats aren't people. Same old argument. However they do still feel pain. Just because they can't say so doesn't make it less. I'm not trying to overhumanize them, just suggesting we can't ignore suffering simply because the sufferer cannot speak. cats.about.com/cs/declawing/a/declawing_2.htmwww.declawing.com/htmls/declawing.htmI can say it hurts worse than neutering the same way you can say it hurts the same Shey. And yes my cats are fixed. There is a reason this procedure is illegal in many countries and the vast majority of adoption agencies require you to state you wont declaw if you adopt.
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Post by sheyd on Jul 1, 2008 13:56:06 GMT -5
I do believe they do suffer - I just believe it is worth it for the long term comfort of cat and household. I also agree there are reasons why some shelters and even countries refuse the procedure - but there are ALSO reasons why it is done. I think it is also sad that cats end up at those same shelters because of the destruction they create just being normal cats. Declawing is better than winding up living in a cage or being euthanized.
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Post by Mel (cherry) on Jul 1, 2008 15:17:55 GMT -5
I have to weigh in on Shey's side here. I love cats, just not their destruction. I grew up with cats and clearly remember my sister being deathly ill from cat scratch fever when she was younger. Im also with Shey about the little holes in your legs when they knead your legs. Call me a barbarian if you must but I also believe in circumcision so...
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Post by yeehaw on Jul 1, 2008 16:07:02 GMT -5
Declawing is better than winding up living in a cage or being euthanized. Really? Extending that logic... then it should be ok to cut hands off thieves (muslums got it right?), castrate rapists, and lobotomize druggies and murderers. Better than winding up in a cage or being euthanized, right? I swear, the idea of declawing a cat is just one of the hallmarks of a lazy individual - if you can't take the time to train your pet and correct bad behavior, don't get one! p.s. gawd..... "But that is why I keep them indoors only. They also use those teeth and claws to kill other animals for sport. Not only is it dangerous to them to go outside, but they are dangerous to other creatures. Inside, with no predators, they don't need their claws." You cannot guarantee your cats will stay inside always and as far as dangerous to other creatures.. OF COURSE! THEY ARE CATS! IT'S WHAT THEY DO! Get a turtle... sounds about more your speed.
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